3D Soviet Flight Officer Natasha Lovek [Archive]

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 02:04

Spry, if i were going to a toystory character look i s'pose i could just leave it there... It's been ages since i've watched that film but i don't remember the humans having much texture work, i'm sure the shaders were better than these though.:) I'd like to get it as real as I can, Not sure what you mean by FF, though if i cant get it photoreal i'd like the look of some high quality painted artwork. i might dump it into zbrush for some extra detailing, perhaps use it to generate a normal or a displacement map with some subtle wrinkles and imperfections.

Bricks, good to hear you're branching out into some organic modelling, i agree it's good to take a break from the greebling and work on something prettier for a change:) thanks mate!

Spry

26th Jan 2007, 02:06

FF = Final Fantasy, foo!

I saw some hideously realistic (compliment there) on a Maya forum a few years back (by years I mean 6 months or so). I wish I'd saved the picture, But it was some of the highest quality imaging I've seen.

I really look forward to seeing this develop :)

Brickhead

26th Jan 2007, 02:10

Mesh shots are important in organics so don't forget to post a mesh shot or two every now and then. So we can see how it's all coming together.

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 02:12

just go and look through the characters at CG talk, you'll see plenty of uber realistic work. As for FF, never seen it, i remember there was a big fuss about its characters at the time, though i'm sure they've been bettered - they had a very painted look in fact i thought. i'd be more than happy to be able to match that quality though.

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 02:12

Mesh shots are important in organics so don't forget to post a mesh shot or two every now and then. So we can see how it's all coming together.

damn, you are settling in quick;)

LennO

26th Jan 2007, 02:25

As for FF, never seen it… they had a very painted look in fact i thought.

So you've never see it. Kinda contradicting yourself there ;>

Nice start on the head. If you'd like to post a wire just to make sure her edgeloops are right once you start making poserpr0n with here… just for tovette ;)

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 02:34

I mean the film itself, lol. i remember seeing some 'making of' footage on tv - which was cool because they even showed the maps being painted, and i've seen plenty of stills since the film came out.

I heard the film was, err, not good. so i've never bothered with it.

Here's a wire...

Ozylot

26th Jan 2007, 03:04

Ok so im not staff, is it ok if I post here? ;)

This is something, I've attempted as well. And I gotta say its much harder then greebling the s#!t out of something.

Is it better to model the body then cloths seperatly or model the entire character as a whole?

BTW, love the green eyes!

Brickhead

26th Jan 2007, 03:10

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 03:12

err, it's ok, just this once;)

It's entirely up to you i think and what you want to do with it, i've seen people model these characters right down to the, err, point where you really have to put a clear warning on the thread.

if you are a real detail nut, or i guess if you want to animate softbody clothing over the top you'd build the entire thing then dress it. so the clothing reacts with the body underneath when you animate.

for this i'll probably build the chest with the suit top, but the bottom half will be the tight fitting clothing there's no need and i can save myself some time. This will hopefully satisfy Tovette enough and allow for a 'cleavagey' final render that i have in mind.

Tovette

26th Jan 2007, 03:16

I did a paint over to correct the anatomical areas i thought to be in error from what I know of figure drawing; just trying to help.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a278/tovette/Flight_Officer_Natasha_Lovek_01_PAI.jpg

Kadaeux

26th Jan 2007, 03:18

Looks sorta like Angelina Jolie mate, thats great work.

Brickhead

26th Jan 2007, 03:20

I like the shape of the original, but I like the shape of the lips of the tweaked.

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 03:21

OK I didn't want to jack you're thread Coolhand but check this link and check out my very first attempt at organics. I haven't abandon it but shelfed it for awhile. I'll probably start from scratch, every time I do I learn a better approach.

Brickhead 3D Model - Page 20 - Forums (http://www.3dscifi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=527&page=20)

AAAAgh! Thats not pretty... Self portrait huh?;)

i like it, it definately needs some z-brushing to add in some detail, and that ear is in need of rebuilding, the rest I can't tell without wires.:)

Brickhead

26th Jan 2007, 03:24

AAAAgh! Thats not pretty... Self portrait huh?;)

i like it, it definately needs some z-brushing to add in some detail, and that ear is in need of rebuilding, the rest I can't tell without wires.:)

Yea self portrait, you could tell huh.....lol

Yea it needs a lot of tweaking but hay it was my first attempt. I'll get it.

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 03:31

Tovette, looks like you've mangled her;) i certainly always struggle with the apples of the cheeks and yours seems flatter somehow. I need to take a second pass at the eye socket area for various reasons and i like the more bee-sting lips (very jolie) but thats not exactly an anatomical constant. for the most part I don't think your mods take it any closer to the various refs i've used but they arguably do take it closer to some idealised woman... Jolie, basically, lol. but the sides of the nose are a tad wobbly as you've illustrated, and It's good to see her with some eyelashes.:)

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 03:36

Yea self portrait, you could tell huh.....lol

Yea it needs a lot of tweaking but hay it was my first attempt. I'll get it.

keep it up, i don't know whether its best to keep working the same mesh or start over, i think most start over of they get stuck. but its hard to offer advice with a clear idea of what you're going for, maybe try a 'less angry' face, if you can do that you can be more confident of self critting a more off the wall character. imo.

Brickhead

26th Jan 2007, 03:40

keep it up, i don't know whether its best to keep working the same mesh or start over, i think most start over of they get stuck. but its hard to offer advice with a clear idea of what you're going for, maybe try a 'less angry' face, if you can do that you can be more confident of self critting a more off the wall character. imo.

I'm going to start over, it's easier and I learn more. Besides he needs his anger.

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 03:40

Lol

Ozylot

26th Jan 2007, 03:44

....Besides he needs his anger.

'Don't make him angry... you won't like him when he's angry' ;)

So the real question is... how does one model hair :shiner:

Tovette

26th Jan 2007, 03:56

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 03:58

Well if you really wanna know, there's there proper, particle hair way models every strand - max can do this with its hair and fur features. other apps can do this too, but not all, i think blender is getting support for this soon. the way i'm doing it here is a texture of hair applied to a plane. I then take the plane and copy it and deform it until fits the shape i want... Not sure if anyone else does it like that, it's basically textured before it's modelled which seems to work well for me. Also means you dont have to faff around with uv-unwrap.

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 04:05

I wasn't sure what references you were going from so I might have gone off course with the 'look' you were going for. I just tried to make what I saw a little less 3D-ish. That's all.

sure, it isn't meant to be a jolie clone, and it isn't quite finished with the tweaking, i think there are some changes to be made - you identified everything i wasn't happy with along with some others, cheers:)

evil_genius_180

26th Jan 2007, 04:20

Awesome work so far. :thumb:

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 04:28

Thanks EG:)

Tovette, feel free to have a go with this one if you want:)

evil_genius_180

26th Jan 2007, 04:41

Wow, that really looks great. I really like the eyes, you did a great job texturing those. They're very life-like.

Spry

26th Jan 2007, 06:27

DAmn, the nose is much imporved man.

Ears are a bit fat tho, but yeah, lets see it progess before we give too many crits :)

Dann-O

26th Jan 2007, 06:27

I think Men are easier because you have no obligation to make them beautiful therfore you can go for a more characture approach. I don't really know what you are going for. But if she is full blodded caucasion then you will need to make the transition over the eyes a bit steeper. Right now it is smooth which is like a chinese girl but the nose bridge says caucasion. There are exceptions in every rule though.

If you want to make her a bit prettier bring back the chin a touch and add some polygons to the lips so you can have more control over the shape of the lips. Soften the transition on the lower lip a bit it is too hard just slide the loop a bit. Really great work look forward to more updates.

Coolhand

26th Jan 2007, 15:54

Eg, I'm quite proud of the eyes but i wanna go back and redo the eye textures, or at least improve them. there isn't as much up close detail as i'd like, also the shaders need work and they won't look their best without a better environment. even so they took about 3 hours to do!

Spry, fat ears? lol you'll give her a complex... yeah they need some tweaking, ears are tough to make.

Danno, thats the kind of mix I was going for and is reflected in some of my refs.

Male characters are much easier, I agree, there's something more subtle about a female face thats much harder to capture.

Ozylot

27th Jan 2007, 00:12

Nice progress.

I really wish to know what it is that makes a face decidedly female. There is definitely something subtle.

Spry

27th Jan 2007, 01:08

Mate, I'll give her or you a complex? :p

OMG, shes so pudgy, someone needs to diet!! :rolleyes:

Coolhand

27th Jan 2007, 01:10

ahh you know how women are, Spry... hehe, well I guess you don't.

:p

Spry

27th Jan 2007, 03:06

ahh you know how women are, Spry... hehe, well I guess you don't.

:p

So what. The Mini Bar doesn't expect me to call..

:shiner:

How but some updates :p

evil_genius_180

27th Jan 2007, 05:19

So what. The Mini Bar doesn't expect me to call..

:shiner:

LMAO, man. :lol: :flippy:

Larsen

27th Jan 2007, 18:44

Looking good CH... Not that I'm entitled to any sort of crit, but I'd say the hairline is somewhat to far ahead!

Looking forward to following this mate:thumb:

Coolhand

27th Jan 2007, 19:20

hmm, you think it should start further back? I think you might be right.:)

Coolhand

27th Jan 2007, 19:51

scraped the hair back some more, dunno if it should come forwards a bit though. I wonder if she uses head and shoulders? LOL. sorry. :D

Ozylot

27th Jan 2007, 20:53

I think your right, perhaps a touch forward is better.

do you have a ref pic to model by or are you just making it up as you go?

Larsen

27th Jan 2007, 20:59

Coolhand

27th Jan 2007, 21:02

i have various ref pics, but none have this type of hair, lol. and It's all how the hairline interacts with the shape of the forehead, it might need reducing in width.

Coolhand

27th Jan 2007, 21:05

The hair on her forehead should be more forward. but the hair on the sides - what's the name temples!?! - besides the eyes is following the hairline on to... it shouldn't!

she needs a tad of that Mickeymouse haircut!

Did I make any sence here!?!

EDIT: The hairline line -lol- is straight from the top of her head to the ear... it should curve!?!

it is curved, its jsut that the angle and curvature of the head is making it look straight if you see what i mean:)

its still not right though.

mickey mouse haircut?

JustinDixon

27th Jan 2007, 21:11

Coolhand, I made a female face once; I uploaded it in hopes you'd find it maybe useful. Have a look at the loops and such.

Larsen

27th Jan 2007, 21:13

Like this:

mental|plate

27th Jan 2007, 22:19

Yup, lars got it...thats a lot better

and shes hot......in 3d kind of way......i'm not spry :p

Coolhand

27th Jan 2007, 22:34

Coolhand, I made a female face once; I uploaded it in hopes you'd find it maybe useful. Have a look at the loops and such.

The loops aren't bad, though she has a certain ET quality to her, which i'm sure could be tweaked out. I think you've modelled it too much without a perspective view. The mesh is probably denser than it needs to be and you have a number of triangles that you might want to look at eliminating. also, I used to use FFd's like that, and they are useful but i find soft selection works better, faster, more precise and flexible. and you don't have to keep adding modifiers to the stack. my stack is editable poly, symmetry and turbosmooth.

lars, i see what you mean, but i think from front on i think thats gonna be looking too straight horizontally.

Here's how i have it now...

mental|plate

27th Jan 2007, 22:41

Now we're talkin'......so....we are not going to see her.....you know??? :D

Coolhand

27th Jan 2007, 22:44

not with guys like you and tovette around...;) and definately not without a warning in the title.:)

Larsen

27th Jan 2007, 22:55

You might be right... And what you have now looks nice man... maybe it's becourse she has her hair back like that... I couldn't help but tamper with this one too...

I'm sorry, it's not like I have a personal grudge against you or something:devil: :shiner: :p

Coolhand

27th Jan 2007, 23:02

the only way i could do that hair, that i know of is to make it properly with the particle type hair, which I will do eventually, but it takes a while to cut and sculpt into something that looks half decent. mind you i guess i could use rows of mapped geometry, like you might add grass to a computer game level or something. anyway, tied back long hair is just so much easier to do, and i dont really want to give her short hair. Sci-fi chicks seem to manage just fine with the longer hair.

Larsen

27th Jan 2007, 23:08

Yeah well... the hair style is personal favor I guess... I was mearly beeing a bitch about it:p And I was trying to illustrate the Mickeymouse cut:D

But the grass approach would work... When ever someone mentiones female soviet personel, I just can't help but think of that chick from 2010:D...

Anyway I think the Mickeycut should be somewhat more visiable... other than that I really have no crits:D

Keep at it!

Coolhand

27th Jan 2007, 23:43

the one who doesn't speak english?

she was cute, but her hair wasn't anything like that iirc! still don't know why you call it mickey mouse hair, lol, must be a danish thing;)

This isn't the final hair btw, part of the project is to make some decent looking hair with the proper max haircut tools.:)

evil_genius_180

28th Jan 2007, 00:57

I know you said she's a hotshot pilot, but I missed it if you said how old she is. She looks like a teenager.

Coolhand

28th Jan 2007, 01:04

hmm, 20-24 maybe haven't worked out her exact background yet. a lot of the age will come from the texturing.

Coolhand

28th Jan 2007, 01:33

some eyelashes... all individually placed around the eye. the eyebrows are using displacement via an image map, but they would benefit from being actual geometry.

Ozylot

28th Jan 2007, 01:54

Yikes... the eyes gotta be one of the hardest parts.

Nice! :thumb:

Coolhand

28th Jan 2007, 02:43

yes, along with everything else:)

cheers mate.

farcry

28th Jan 2007, 02:49

Wow, nice work on her man, she's lookin' fine :shiner:

Never could get into character modeling, gave me headaches just trying to shape a head. Gonna be watching this thread alot :thumb:

evil_genius_180

28th Jan 2007, 02:50

Yeah, my hat's off to anyone who can master organics. It's got to be tough. The eyelashes look great. I'd thought some of the age might come from texturing, but I didn't know if there were any modeling tricks before that. Of course, there's not much difference in appearance between late teens and early twenties.

Coolhand

28th Jan 2007, 03:21

Wow, nice work on her man, she's lookin' fine :shiner:

Never could get into character modeling, gave me headaches just trying to shape a head. Gonna be watching this thread alot :thumb:

thanks mate, and you're meant to shape the head on the screen, not your own.;)

Eg, you can model in more detail, age lines and things, or you can dump it into something like z-brush and make a normal or a displacement map, i;d maybe have go, but i'm not sure what i'd do with it once its in there and its real easy to over-exagerate imperfections. i'm hoping the texturing will be enough.

evil_genius_180

28th Jan 2007, 03:33

i'm hoping the texturing will be enough.

It should be good. She's still young enough to not have too many lines. That's why I was asking. Definitely great work so far. :cool:

Brickhead

28th Jan 2007, 04:17

Yea nice job on the lashes, IMO I think the brows should be arched a little more, IMO.

Dann-O

28th Jan 2007, 09:33

Are you using an SSS shader? It is one of those subtle things that really brings a model out. It is very tricky and a pain in the butt sometimes. Some little things if you want the ouside corners of the lower lip seem to be out a bit too full. Also I would just skip the red in the eyes keep them clear or just a tiny vein or two comming out from the corner. Take a look at the way woody did hair here I think it is awsome and something I did not think of before. Subdivision Modeling (http://www.subdivisionmodeling.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1639&d=1156934881)
here is the thread.
Celebrity Head:Woody:Zhang ZiYi - Subdivision Modeling (http://www.subdivisionmodeling.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1516)
Just thought you would want to see that I think it might really work on this one. Take a look at this forum there are a nuber of interesting threads.

Coolhand

28th Jan 2007, 19:47

Cheers for the comments guys,

Dann-O, I hope you apply some of that advice to your own work, it's consistently let down by the shaders you use (and often the lighting, but that's a whole different topic) It just seems that you know more about it than you practise, i'm slightly surprised. Thanks for the crits, am i using SSS at the moment? no, i might experiment with it at some point, it does seem on the surface (lol) to be the best solution however it can lead to a very waxy look and at least in the past it was very poor at simulating the thin nature of skin... so the SSS will try and simulate skin that is much thicker than it should be leading to that waxy look. the last time i made a character like this (sadly the model and all the images were lost when my hdd and the SFM server blew up at nearly the same time last year) i ended up using the 'moodee' shader or something like that which is a kind of multi layer shader which let me setup multiple falloffs to fake the scattering to a certain extent. It was ok, but i hope to improve on it.

Could you summarise what that guys hair technique was? i cant see that forum and i can get plenty of character modelling info at CGtalk there are some huge threads on the topic on those boards. i'm still set on using the hair tools eventually but perhaps it's something i haven't heard of.

Brickhead, yeah to make those i basically took a section of the forehead, then made a material which is transparent apart from the brows, which were painted hair for hair from a reference pic, originally they were even straighter, but i adjusted them in the UV editor, maybe not enough.;) I think i'll probably build them from individual 'hairs' eventually, but i'll try some more curvature out with the maps while its easy to adjust.

Eg, thanks man.:)

specs2

28th Jan 2007, 21:22

a few hints. try an extra geometry layer over the area, where you want the eye brows. I find DAZ's Millenium Figures an inspiration for that, they have that too.
I'd also recommend, you use real textures for the skin and drop the shaders for the skin material.
the hair needs more then one layer and give it some extra geometry for strands and hair that doesn't hang tight on the head but slightly loose on it, to give it some more volume. that way, you can work with transparency to make it look more real. otherwise, check, if you can try it with a hair plugin for your software. they tend to have some very nice results these days.
the head geometry is fine work, nothing to criticise there.

Coolhand

28th Jan 2007, 21:41

Thanks specs, for the eyebrows its currently a single layer of geometry over the face geometry, do you mean I should try 2 layers of eyebrow geometry over the face?

For the textures yeah i'm sure thats the best way, i'm torn between painting it and using photos, it's all a matter of getting the right kind of photo's though, do you know of any sites with some suitable images?

Thats a great tip for the hair, i'll work on that i think, i had some nice results from using displacement on the hair that i haven't posted yet i think some extra layers would really improve it.

Thanks again:)

specs2

28th Jan 2007, 21:46

mmh, I know one, but the photos aren't for free. still, levius provides a lot of good texture resources and in your case it will probably fit even better, because, I think, most of his models come from eastern europe, making it easy for your to find a suitable texture reference.
All the Human Photo References and Textures 3D Artist Wants (http://www.3d.sk/)
if you need help on the uv mapping, i'll gladly provide help ;)

Coolhand

28th Jan 2007, 21:52

I'll be fine with the unwrapping, but thanks anyway, cheers for the link too, I'll probably get some from there, it seems pretty reasonable:)

Guerrilla

28th Jan 2007, 21:54

Human Anatomy Pictures for Artists Online (http://www.fineart.sk) and All the Human Photo References and Textures 3D Artist Wants (http://www.3d.sk) are usually the first one that come to mind. Here's a nifty tutorial using maps from 3d.sk: 3DTotal Tutorials (http://67.15.36.49/team/tutorials/astil_afro/astil_afro_01.asp)

If you're dropping her in zbrush, check out Kris Kosta's videos on pixologic for texturing from photos.

[edit]specs was faster. :p

Coolhand

28th Jan 2007, 21:58

Cheers G.:) I'm probably going to skip the z-brush stage but i'll take a look at that and see if it changes my mind... zbrush worked pretty well on the grey i made couple of years ago.:)

toby-wan

28th Jan 2007, 22:00

caucasian human female = very brave modeler

it's improving with each update.

Guerrilla

28th Jan 2007, 22:01

Probably a good idea. For some reason whatever pretty I put in zbrush comes out as a zombie at least once. :p

"I felt like destroying something beautiful."

Coolhand

28th Jan 2007, 22:09

caucasian human female = very brave modeler

it's improving with each update.

LOL thanks mate!

G, ROFL! yeah it's way to easy to get carried away with it:)

Ramiel

29th Jan 2007, 03:38

If I can give you just one small suggestion Steve...

Don't use just your imagination to model her, use references!

Yes, it sounds stupid, but trust me, when you start working on a "generic" or "ideal" face you'll made a lot of tiny mistakes (like perfect symmetry, perfect shapes and things like that...).
Human face (even the prettiest) is less than perfect or symmetrical, so , choose a face (a friend, a model or an actress, it doesn't matter) and use it!
Sometimes I do the same thing when I'm doing comics!;)
Good work so far!:D

Coolhand

29th Jan 2007, 04:34

hey ramiel.:) err, did i say i wasn't using refs? i've based the model pretty much entirely on a mix references - along with some of my own ideas. The difference between drawing a character and modelling one in 3d is that one can take advantage of only having to build one side, effectively halving the work involved. The symmetry will be dealt with prior to rigging, after i've modelled, unwrapped and textured the character. So it's really a post modelling process and to add assymmetry now would not be the smartest move, what if i wanted to change something? I'd either have to throw away the assymetric tuning or carefully adjust each side so as to not introduce too much. I could perhaps add a noise modifier on top of the stack to add some arbitrary deformations (which i've done with the hair) but that might cause wierd things to happen with the way the face interacts with the eyes and lashes. Phew... Thanks anyway though mate.:)

Dann-O

29th Jan 2007, 14:11

What I did was modeled a single poly wide strip with 8 segments, than
copied/pasted that around the head, shaping it to establish volume for the hair.
I posted a render of it at this stage in this post:

After that, I went back, selected the edges of my strips and bridged them,
then loop sliced them down the length three or four times a piece with random
placement, after all that, simple edge extrusion to get the little valleys.

A quote on hot that hair was made if you want to look. I just thougth it was a novel approach. (Personally with my current software I can't do this so I am just realying what I saw)

I have only a little over one months experiece with the package I am currently using I might have some room to grow into it and get better. I find even though my forays into SSS have been less than perfect I look at my renders without and they look like cement. In Messiah there is not a big render hit for SSS so it is no big one. My heads have a characture look to them so are not realistic. I draw them like that too some things are the way they are as a choice.

Personally I saw the Incredibles at least 10 times I don't think I was able to sit through one veiwing of final fantasy. So you need to make a choice for what look you really want. What points to exaggerate and what to push back.

Ramiel

29th Jan 2007, 22:56

Oh, no Steve, mine was just a generic suggestion, not a comment on your actual model (I know that this sentence doesn't make sense...).
I've modeled a face before (a monster face to be honest), and I used the mirror tool too (it's insane to do two times something you can simply copy), I was commenting just on the realism of a CG face... the best things to do to help the realism of a CG face are imperfections.
Keep this in mind (I know you already knew this, but that's the only think I can suggest you!) and when you have done the model, just add these "human features"...:D
Keep it up!

Coolhand

30th Jan 2007, 18:55

Yeah ramiel, i somtimes forget you model too. Good points worth mentioning, thanks buddy:) I'm glad you like the face, you are something of an expert... lol:)

Dann-O thanks for posting that, it's kinda similar to how i've made her hair but he's worked a lot more detail into it.

I do like your unique style, i don't know a lot about messiah but i think studying some more shader theory would help you, as an exercise try to simulate some real world materials... It's something i've always found to be challenge and some of the best work i've seen has probably had as much time spent on the materials and shaders (perhaps more) than the modelling. Keep working on it, you'll get there.. i'm still working on it and learning more after years of practice:)

Ramiel

30th Jan 2007, 22:57

Yep, probably I should post more 3D here...:lol:
:D

Viper

31st Jan 2007, 18:50

I don't think you should underestimate Zbrush on this one. Easy to get carried away, yes, but it'll allow you to do some fine detail that is very hard to accomplish sometimes when texturing. If you hop over to the Pixologic forums, I saw a guy doing a Natalie Portman model exclusively in Zbrush, and it was one of the best models I've seen in a long while, yet she didn't come out as monster like, heh.

Oh, and for the WIP pics, post some low-poly wires, and I'd dump the wierd skin shader too, cause it looks kinda amateurish :p (No offense intended) A simple clay render should do. At least post the wires so we can see your topology and comment on it :)

Coolhand

31st Jan 2007, 18:59

yeah the current shader sucks, but i'm just working on the shape at the moment so who cares?

i can't stand grey clay renders of this kind of thing, it just doesn't help me.

check out the wires a few pages back.:)

aszazeroth

31st Jan 2007, 19:37

Well the current shader is a nice WIP shader for sure... good progress and nice modelling on this project, Steve.

Coolhand

31st Jan 2007, 21:24

Brickhead

1st Feb 2007, 03:00

Hey Coolhand, are you going to give this babe a hardcore Russian uniform with the one of those sharp stand up collars? I think she would look good in that....or a bikini, or wet T-shirt what ever you think will be just fine.....lol

Ramiel

1st Feb 2007, 03:40

Oh, c'mon you are a Sensei now Brickhead... You should be an example for the other members!
...
...
...

Ok, I have a pornstar in my avatar now, but that's another story...
:lol: :lol: :lol:

Viper

1st Feb 2007, 03:43

Thanks asz, and viper, i really wasn't dissing zbrush in any way, i know its powerful it just isn't my thing, i quite enjoy painting in it, but i'm not great at sculpting with it. If i tried to make natalie portman in it she'd probably end up more like yoda, i prefer poly editing:)

Oh, I am not saying you should model the whole thing in Zbrush...poly gives a lot more control. Just saying that importing your model in and doing a quick facelift might be good. I did that a couple of times while experimenting with a few head models I did in 3ds max and the quality increased a lot :)

As for the wire...there are a few things you can change to make it better. Do you mind if I do a quick paint over on it?

Coolhand

1st Feb 2007, 03:57

sure, go right ahead.

Dann-O

1st Feb 2007, 09:33

Well waiting for updates. I always think Z brush can be sort of a two edged sword. You have the advantage of meshpainting but you make your polycount go out of sight. Now if you are rendering just a picture of a character nothing else then Z-Brush is great but if you want to make a pic of the entire crew on break in the engine room. Playing guitar and whatnot Z bush might make them a bit too much for your system.

I know you can also do normal maps which is something I am really interested in but know nothing about. About shaders I know there is a lot to learn there.

Coolhand

1st Feb 2007, 18:31

I think the idea is that you would either make a normal map or a displacement map from zbrush, probably displacement but thats a pretty large rendering overhead. Viper knows more about that than me though:)

Guerrilla

1st Feb 2007, 19:03

Usually I take a displacement map out. Basically all that wonderful detail you've painted in the mesh gets captured in what is essentially a bump map. The real magic happens in the renderer. You can't really do **** with the map unless your renderer has proper displacement. In max that'd mean MentralRay, FinalRender or Vray. With these three you can actually use the displacement map without ever adding another poly on the object, since they calculate the extra triangles only at rendertime (ideally on a per/bucket basis). Without a proper displacement engine you might as well skip the exporting a map bit and just import the whole damn mesh. It's gonna take just as long to render. :p

Normal maps work in a similar fashion, but if your renderer does MTD just go with displacement. I've never actually gotten a completely clean normal (no tweaking required) map out of zbrush.

Coolhand

1st Feb 2007, 19:09

yeah displacement is very useful, i used it a lot in my crate contest entry (the freaky thing in my avatar) you don't necessarily need zbrush for that though, the ones use for my avatar were simply painted in photoshop. It can quite easily quadruple your render times though, especially when wirking with sample based renderers like MR, you really need to drive the samples up to get a clean looking displacement. Of course i think you could take the displacement map and bake it into the mesh so the computer doesn't have to do all the displacement computations.

but then you need a light mesh for rigging, so i don't think that or importing the full detail mesh will work.

aszazeroth

1st Feb 2007, 19:09

you should write a tutorial, G :devil:

Brickhead

1st Feb 2007, 22:20

you should write a tutorial, G :devil:

Actually that's not a bad idea, I know you're busy but a quick layout of how you handle this would be awesome.

Coolhand

1st Feb 2007, 22:22

Brickhead

1st Feb 2007, 22:33

i think guerilla already linked to a tutorial a few pages back if you wanna check it out.

*edit: infact he didn't, lol, least not for that.

it is a well covered topic though there's plenty of that info at zbrush specific sites if you wanna check it out for your organic... then you can write a tutorial for us, bricks:)

What ever you say bounces off of me and sticks to you, they don't call me brickhead for nothing....lol

I'll check it out, geez all you had to say was no........lol

Coolhand

1st Feb 2007, 22:40

are you still here? shouldn't you be working on that tutorial;)

Brickhead

1st Feb 2007, 22:42

are you still here? shouldn't you be working on that tutorial;)

I'm actually working on something else that I will post in a couple of hours.:devil:

Coolhand

1st Feb 2007, 22:45

:cool:

Larsen

1st Feb 2007, 22:48

I'm actually working on something else that I will post in a couple of hours.:devil:

And I think I know what it is:D

Ok I admit... I'm bored... I should be working on 'The Freya'... It's just so much fun posting totally useless replys:D

Coolhand

2nd Feb 2007, 03:41

hey an update, holy crap!

here's start of the body, though i'm still not totally done with the face, most of the body that you see here still needs work on the topology and shape, i know there's a lot wrong with it but it thought i'd better post something.;)

Brickhead

2nd Feb 2007, 04:46

lol.....you want me to tell you what's wrong with it, and believe me it won't be to technical.....lol

Coolhand

2nd Feb 2007, 04:51

hmm, let me guess... lose the bikini? larger breasts? both? hehe;)

Brickhead

2nd Feb 2007, 04:52

hmm, let me guess... lose the bikini? larger breasts? both? hehe;)

LOL......I couldn't resist, but she needs some hands for Gods sake.

Brickhead

2nd Feb 2007, 04:55

She looks good but check the transition between the shoulder, Posterior and lateral region and the Trapezoid.

Coolhand

2nd Feb 2007, 05:02

Hands are nearly a separate project in themselves, like the ear, it's a tricky piece to get right, i'll probably get the rest of the body and legs in place before i get to the hands.

thanks for the crits brickhead, i've yet to check them properly against refs... man my knowledge of anatomy is lacking. which part is the trapezoid?

evil_genius_180

2nd Feb 2007, 05:09

I'm voting for lose the bikini. :devil:

Seriously, great work. I don't know anything about organics, so I can't give any advice.

aszazeroth

2nd Feb 2007, 06:45

No "hammer and sickle" bikini ?! ;)

jay-mo

2nd Feb 2007, 15:24

WOw, this is a change from what you usually post. It's great to see this. I've also been practicing up on modelling humans too. I know your not really concerned about the shader right now, but for some reason it always helps me to see the end result might look like, so I've been trying to find a good wip shader. Here's one where I've been fooling around with reflection settings. It has an oily/sweaty look, which might look good with that bikini:D She's a beauty by the way.
*thread hi-jacking alert*

Larsen

2nd Feb 2007, 16:57

Sweet touch with the stars mate... A real patriot too huh:D

Coolhand

2nd Feb 2007, 18:51

Thanks guys, lars i couldn't resist, i put the stars on the ships so why not the pilot? :D

Eg, might have guessed;)

Asz, suggestion noted. heh.

Jay, that looks awesome, hey it's brickhead, right?;) Great work on the face, do you wanna post any wires?

Coolhand

2nd Feb 2007, 22:05

finally went back to make some improvements to the face topology after again referencing some wires over at CGtalk. pretty much the whole lower part of the face has been rebuilt by cutting and welding it into new polys and moving them to keep the same look. this was to give it better polyflow along the jaw also the chin is much improved - i'm pretty sure that the old scructure would have perhaps caused some animation problems. I also started adjusting the cheek/nose intersection, though that tweaking has disturbed the polys on the bridge of the nose, i''m sure i can fix that if i stare at long enough...

Samurai

2nd Feb 2007, 22:11

Man, I lost a load of super hi-res anatomical photographs when my last laptop imploded. bloody great big .tiff files I used for life drawing in college projects. was basically 360* worth of views of male and female, with close ups on faces, ears and wrists/ankles. each file was about 4000 x 4000. I really should have backed those up, I still miss having them to hand... :(

In that last update, you might want to check the poly's where the jawbone meets the earlobe- seems there's some overlapping edges, but I'm not sure...

Coolhand

2nd Feb 2007, 22:15

thanks greg, those pictures would have been incredibly handy, cheers. lol

and, yeah it's a bit screwed up there.

Samurai

2nd Feb 2007, 22:20

Sorry- caught me in a contemplative mood. :shiner:

Ozylot

2nd Feb 2007, 23:28

Nice!!!

I agree with EG180. :D

Face is looking good.

Brickhead

3rd Feb 2007, 04:43

Coolhand I might be stating the obvious to you but what I see is a few five point areas. The bridge of the nose is one in particular. That's easily fixed with the edge tool, same for the lower jaw line. easily fix buy selecting the two intersecting edges and removing them, then select the tree edges along the jaw line and connecting them, this should follow the topology of the jaw. Same for the nose, you can see the edges pulling and creating an error in the flow of the mesh. But I assume you know all this.

Coolhand

3rd Feb 2007, 05:21

thanks mate, you mean where you have 5 lines off a vertex? the ones on the jaw, and the two that i have around the nose don't seem to be causing me any trouble at the moment, the bridge of the nose hase been kinda fixed up too, there are also a couple of poles that might cause problems. feel free to draw in any improvements you can see. here's a nearly latest render and the latest wire.

Brickhead

3rd Feb 2007, 05:39

I have to say the nose looks great, I wouldn't mess with it at all. I think the most valuable tool is the edge connect. There are a few areas that the edges stop abruptly and might benefit from a continuous edge, the area around the ear for one, but if the topology in that area is sufficient then I see little reason to change it. 5 points somewhere are hard to avoid. The last render, she looks real good.

Coolhand

3rd Feb 2007, 06:03

thanks brickhead, i'm currently going back through it again, lol. its saved there though, so if i mess it up too much...;)

Coolhand

25th Apr 2007, 09:24

Latest update, I rebuilt the face sometime back but didn't have chance to post an update. She now has a fairly roughed out hand, and the beginings of a stylised flight/pressure suit. To keep things simple the body just joins into the bottom part of the suit, but the top of the suit will be a separate object.

The suit design itself i want to be quite organic looking, it's basically just padded, but as you can see it'll be along the lines of the still suits from dune or something slightly giger-ish more than a modern flightsuit or spacesuit. Almost like the underpart of a real EVA suit which carries pipes and stuff around the suit but all that visible on the outside.

Coolhand

25th Apr 2007, 18:52

Starting the upper part of the suit, obviously the bikini top wasn't a very practical space garment...

aszazeroth

25th Apr 2007, 19:08

Looking nice there Steve... Like how you seem to have captured some east european lines and shapes.

Keep it up !

mental|plate

25th Apr 2007, 19:11

Noooooooooo....shes fully dressed....

:shiner:

nice update man!

biotech

25th Apr 2007, 20:07

Nice work, dont know how I missed this before, I'm always impressed when people scratch build people this well without going the poser route.

Coolhand

25th Apr 2007, 21:17

Thanks guys, Asz, biotech, i'm mostly just pleased she's looking human. Don't look too closely at the hands and arms though, they haven't had much refinement yet.

Mentalplate, apologies for the current state of dress, i promise the final renders will be more revealing;) Lots more work to do until we get to that point though.

Ozylot

25th Apr 2007, 21:42

Looks great! Its not an easy task, but you've done very well up to this point. :thumb:

Firelode

25th Apr 2007, 22:27

Looking very good, the face is particularly well proportioned, you might want to change some of the proportions in the torso, it's slightly unflattering in some areas. Is she rigged already? If so, did you setup your own bones or did you use a biped?

Coolhand

25th Apr 2007, 22:32

cheers guys, firelode, could you be more specific? eventually i'll use biped / physique for the rigging.

Firelode

25th Apr 2007, 22:39

You can use the bones system, custom created bones instead of biped, it's tricky and frankly not really needed for humans but if you has something with multiple articulated armatures, aliens, robots etc. They can be handy, obviously the good flight officer does not have 3 arms and unless you plan on making her walk like a crab biped will be fine.

Coolhand

25th Apr 2007, 22:44

no i mean about the torso lol!:) yeah i've used both systems in the past... building a rig from scratch is a pain, and physique simulates whats happening under the skin in a much more detailed way than the old skin modifier.

Coolhand

26th Apr 2007, 02:17

one last update for tonight.

Ozylot

26th Apr 2007, 02:25

awesome! Do you have a scene in mind to use her in?

Tovette

26th Apr 2007, 04:16

awesome! Do you have a scene in mind to use her in?

bow chicka bow bowpmpn

SGC_Sam Fisher

26th Apr 2007, 06:07

bow chicka bow bowpmpn

Shut it Tucker J/K.

one last update for tonight.

Very nice, though I have to ask. Is there a zipper missing? Because right now, it looks like the only thing keeping her top in place are her uhh, assets.

DarthMaya

26th Apr 2007, 06:12

Shut it Tucker J/K.

*Insert Red Vs Blue quote here.* :D

Coolhand

26th Apr 2007, 17:44

Very nice, though I have to ask. Is there a zipper missing? Because right now, it looks like the only thing keeping her top in place are her uhh, assets.

hehe, no i thought i'd just leave it open to space;) Problem with zippers is that they aren't terribly airtight, so it might end up being more like the seal on a baggie or something else perhaps. I'm open to suggestions...

Of course it should be one piece and sealed at the waist, you want to keep the amount seals you use to a minimum, but i want it to be more like a jacket. Past science fiction space suits have used anything from zippers to velcro though so i guess i can get away with anything and say its a special scifi version.

Ozy, Yes... not what Tovette is thinking though.;)

Knight26

26th Apr 2007, 19:05

sorceress21

26th Apr 2007, 19:27

Damn Coolhand, give the bitch some support would ya!! Jeez...Great model but she' got like a teenage body with geriatric hooters!!

Coolhand

26th Apr 2007, 19:35

Dang coolhand is there anything you can't model? Seriously man great work reminds me a lot of the Mechanical Counter Pressure (MPC) Suit. Atomic Rocket: Space Suits (http://www.projectrho.com/rocket/rocket3m.html) Look about halfway down the page. As for the zipper problem: I think Heinlein or Niven, possibly Asimov did this first, but they had a sealant compound on the zipper that sealed the suit when they closed the zipper, then when you openned the zipper it had the solvent on it, or something to that effect. It's been a while and I am getting over a stomach bug, ugh.

Thats a fantastic concept it's probably crazy enough to work... almost like a wetsuit for space, i hadn't heard of that before. This suit isn't intended to work in the same way, just to look as bulk free as possible -compared to an actual pressure suit which i imagine is a bit like having a big balloon all around you. in places this would probably be just skin to suit but the suit itself would be pressurised so those convex areas would be full of air. Maybe that makes this a hybrid? or perhaps thats just how every pressure suit works...:D hmm, i might have to say that the suit uses mechanical pressure... it just suits the design of the suit better.

Ozylot

26th Apr 2007, 19:43

It would be neat if you could work some electronics into the design a little.

Choo1701

26th Apr 2007, 20:26

you mean like the ones from the Lost in Space movie??? :confused:

... what? .... :runs:

Coolhand

26th Apr 2007, 21:22

Damn Coolhand, give the bitch some support would ya!! Jeez...Great model but she' got like a teenage body with geriatric hooters!!

Ouch... Those are just natural, pendulous... polygons. but i have made the suit take up a bit more of the 'slack'.

ozy, like what exactly and where? i'm trying to keep it as minimal and light as possible so there might be extra gear worn when eva'ing... maybe some of that should be built into the suit?

Ozylot

26th Apr 2007, 21:32

Choo kinda touched on what I was thinking a bit, the suits they wore on the movie lost in space had a small device built into the suit by the collarbone or lapel.

It seemed at one point that the stasis system hooked into it.

The idea I had was to have all the bio-sensors and such built into the suit. a small device visible on the outside of the suit could have a small indicators for stuff like heart beat, blood pressure, temperature etc. Might also have a port on it for connecting med scanners, comm systems and stuff.

Just an idea. ;) She's looking good though!

sorceress21

26th Apr 2007, 21:33

Ouch... Those are just natural, pendulous... polygons. but i have made the suit take up a bit more of the 'slack'.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c149/kiribell/spit.gifThat may very well be the single most hilarious thing I've heard on SFM to date...I just about fell out of my chair when I read it...pendulous polygons...You're killin me Coolhand.

efritsch

26th Apr 2007, 22:06

She's looking almost real.

As for the suit, how does a current divers Dry Suit work? I know that it keeps the water totally out, and I'm fairly sure it zips up the back. Maybe something like that with the built in bio indicator idea that Ozy suggested.

Coolhand

26th Apr 2007, 22:27

hmm, interesting thanks for the suggestion.

Below is from Wikipedias page about drysuits... looks like a zip would actually be fine!

Waterproof Entry

Waterproof zipper installed on a membrane type dry suitModern dry suits have a waterproof zipper for entry and exit which was originally developed by NASA to hold air inside astronaut space suits. The zipper is commonly installed across the back of the shoulders, but can also be found diagonally across the front of the torso, on the side, or straight down the middle of the front or back.

There are many zipper arrangements in use because the zipper is very rigid, and cannot stretch at all, which can make it difficult for a user to get into and out of the suit. The zipper opening is often quite small, since a large zipper makes the suit stiffer and more difficult to use. Some complex zipper arrangements that wrap around the neck or chest let the suit swing open with a flap or hinge point.

Dry suits may also be fitted with an extra waterproof zipper "fly" to let the user urinate when the suit is worn for long periods. Some snug-fitting suits may also use wrap-around expansion zippers that allow the suit to expand or contract to fit different size people.

Before waterproof zips were invented, other methods had to be devised, with the most common being a long rubber entry tunnel which would be flattened shut, then rolled together from the sides and finally folded and clamped with a metal clip. An early example was the Sladen suit, where the entry tunnel was at the umbilicus. The Louisiana-based drysuit company [--AQUALA-- (http://www.aquala.com/) Aquala] still makes a "historical" diving suit of that kind.

Another type was a rubber tunnel that protruded through a normal cloth zipper. The tunnel would be rolled shut and the zipper closed to hold the roll in place. At least one make of old-type British frogman's drysuit was one-piece with a wide neck hole for entry; the bottom of the hood and the edge of the suit's neck hole were held together by a large circular steel clamp around the neck; there was a watertight seal in the bottom of the hood. Two-piece drysuit designs in full length for year-round use and "shorty" styles for summer-season use were also common in the 1950s and early 1960s. Two-piece suits of the period include the American-made Spearfisherman frogman suit, US Divers Seal Suit and the So Lo Marx Skooba Totes suit, the Italian-made Pirelli suit and the UK-made Heinke Delta suit and Siebe-Heinke Dip suit. These suits were sealed at the waist by rolling together the excess material at the bottom of the shirt and the top of the pants. A cummerbund, rail, or surgical tubing was sometimes provided to make the seal more waterproof. [www.customworks.co.uk/ Customworks] of Idaho manufactures a modern version of the two-piece drysuit. Though lacking such features as valves and zippers, these suits still have certain advantages over their modern counterparts. For example, they are cheaper, less bulky, more easily repaired and the footed pants could also double as fishing waders.

Stonecold

27th Apr 2007, 10:04

BTW, if you want to be a bit more realistic - the star should go on the left side of the chest ;)

al3d

27th Apr 2007, 11:02

Steve..i need to get you into a strip club for an evening..;)..proportions are a wee bit off..hehehe

Coolhand

27th Apr 2007, 12:20

al3d

27th Apr 2007, 12:42

Stonecold, Oh her left...

Al, could ya be any more specific? she fits my refs... well apart from the arms. Btw, if you're ever in my neck of the woods i'll take you to the finest strip club around, just make sure you bring your own fiver's. - British fiver's none of that canadian crap.;)

hehehe.....

proportion wise, in my eye, the stomach area seems to short, and upper leg as well compared to the lower leg and breast seems to low..:)

Coolhand

27th Apr 2007, 13:33

...and make sure you sit on your hands, i don't wanna be chucked out, again...;)

Cheers Al, yeah i think you're right, the distance between the shoulders and the bottom of the pubic area is off, which was throwing a lot of things off a bit... i dropped the whole pubic area and the knees down by about an inch and a half and nudged the breasts up by about an inch, i think it's improved it.

Knight26

27th Apr 2007, 14:40

Much better

Dimitriy

27th Apr 2007, 19:00

hmm...is there smth off with the legth of her hands or is just me being a eastern-european gorilla?

al3d

27th Apr 2007, 19:47

now since she's suppose to be a little atletic, she needs wider shoulders. a sign of a woman who's had training is shoulders wider then her hips. so smaller hips, and wider shoulders..:)..it's getting there. arms and legs might seem a bit on the tin side as well...but just a tad..i look at her and even with the tick suit, she looks very skiny

Coolhand

27th Apr 2007, 20:26

infact i just reduced the shoulders a bit for that last shot... lol, i'm not sure which i prefer... and yeah ignore the hands and arms - i've hardly worked on them they're mishapen and well, crap. i did say a few posts back to disregard them for the moment, the legs, well the thighs are too thin i agree... i'm still working on the pattern of the padding so they might end up being totally rebuilt.

Ozylot

27th Apr 2007, 20:59

Thats the hardest part I found as well, getting all the proportions right so that the curves will be in the right spots.

Coming along great!

Binkerman

27th Apr 2007, 21:45

@Coolhand

You have a PM

Jas

Coolhand

20th May 2007, 02:29

thanks guys, sorry i haven't updated this in a while i've been working on other things, but i thought i'd post this image. It's using mental ray's sss skin shader and it looks a bit better than i expected with no maps, the lips btw are just a standard material - they'll be painted into the skin material eventually.

Ramiel

20th May 2007, 05:09

Is coming along nicely:D

Coolhand

20th May 2007, 07:23

Thanks Ramiel:)

well i started messing around with it some more changed the collar, some of the materials. for some reason the hair material has stopped working properly.

Dann-O

20th May 2007, 08:35

Looks good the one thing I see that looks a bit out of place is the red in the whites of the eyes. It is too near the iris and when looking at the face draws a bit too much attention. It would be better to go without or make it just a bit between the iris and the corner and not right up on the iris.

Only noticable in the big blown up shot in the avitar it is unoticiable. Good work getting there.

Coolhand

20th May 2007, 09:06

Thank you Dann-O, well spotted on the eyes, but you know, she's probably tired, been out on space patrol etc...;) i've been meaning to fix it for ages, repaint the whites completely because all the little blood vessels i painted in could be improved, and maybe even do some more work on the iris.

Ozylot

21st May 2007, 01:25

Thats come a long way! Mind sharing a wire?

I love the green eyes! but then again.. I like green :D

Dallidas

21st May 2007, 03:01

dont know how i missed one your projects coolhand. modeling looks great! im assuming you will give her a proper skin shader(SSS included?) and some nicer hair?

efritsch

21st May 2007, 17:27

She's looking good Coolhand! My only crit is that her hair is too fine. It looks far too smooth tied back. You should be able to see more definition in the hair.

Coolhand

22nd May 2007, 11:04

yeah the hair sucks, it's just simple, mapped geometry - and i mean simple. I'm planning on replacing it with some 'particle' hair at some point.

specs2

22nd May 2007, 11:44

is there a reason, why you haven't modelled the inner mouth? I mean, it would be useful for speech.

Coolhand

22nd May 2007, 12:00

yes, thats because i haven't modelled it yet. Strangely enough, it's one of the many reasons that this is still a wip.

specs2

22nd May 2007, 12:02

mmh, not far away from the real texturing work in my opinion.

Coolhand

30th May 2007, 07:16

ooh, thats still a while away yet i think.

made some subtle but important changes to the face, i hadn't quite been happy with it since i rebuilt it. so, i went through and basically tweaked every vertex in face, again.

specs2

30th May 2007, 07:26

mmh, not quiet happy with her mouth corners. the loops seem too hard. can I see the wire frame?

Larsen

30th May 2007, 07:45

Well she's certainly wide awake and allert considdering she just came back from a tour:D:devil:

Nice to see you working on her again... Looking better all the time man, keep it up:thumb:

Coolhand

30th May 2007, 08:45

specs, i think i know what you mean, it could probably do with a little tweaking...though the sharp transition between the lip material and the skin material makes it look a bit harsher than it is.

Lars, it's all those stim pills she has to take on duty... shes pretty wired.;)

Coolhand

31st May 2007, 01:31

found a little more time for some more vertex tweaks, also trying out a different colour for the flightsuit. this aids visibility which might aid a rescue mission (though optical would be the last form of detection you'd use to find someone in space) but the darker suit is probably more slimming.:shiner:

Ozylot

31st May 2007, 01:49

I like it!

What are the little 'glass things' on her hips?

hal

31st May 2007, 02:02

^ They look look like oxygen and bio-medical connectors to me.

Looking very cool Coolhand, I like the design of the spacesuit.

Coolhand

31st May 2007, 02:18

bah, thats the last time i'm using lume metal shader...;p

yeah hals right, those 'glass' things are something like that but those are actually caps for the connectors.

Dann-O

31st May 2007, 09:30

I like the red. If shows off the figure a bit better. My only comment is the rendering and that could mean nothing after all not a finished product. I see the nostrils are lit up; might mean a non shadow casting light. But it can be nothing after all it is a WIP and you are probably using quicker renders. I really like the material for the suit also. Great work.

Coolhand

31st May 2007, 20:48

might be something weird going on with the lighting, i'm not sure. here's another couple of renders i made last night, same problem but i'm sure it's nothing. and i'm still torn between high and low vis schemes for the suit...

Starship

31st May 2007, 21:47

That´s a nice girl but, there is something about the body that my eyes are saying it´s a bit strange... Therefore I can´t say what. Isn´t with the torso, but with her legs and ass, maybe the pelvis, I think. Excuse me if it´s confuse...

About the colors, Red fits better.;)

gonk droid

1st Jun 2007, 08:11

what a difference between the first image and the last update. nice progress.

the dark/thick outer ring of her eyes are throwing me off a bit. the gradient seems too steep.

specs2

1st Jun 2007, 08:48

i prefer the dark version. but you need to define more the shapes of the suit. those blobs look strange.

Coolhand

1st Jun 2007, 09:14

thanks for the comments guys. specs, what 'blobs'?

specs2

1st Jun 2007, 09:49

those dark bulges on her suit, that might be cushions (spelled right?)

Coolhand

4th Jun 2007, 02:14

well, those are meant to be like that, it's like padding or inflatable padding or something... something with a bit of 'give' - leeway or slack - they aren't meant to be like hard edges.

i think i prefer the dark version too btw.

specs2

4th Jun 2007, 06:54

I wasn't talking about hard edges on it. but somehow they still look too random.

Binkerman

4th Jun 2007, 15:31

I like the improvements to the face, looks very attractive now, ... and those lips are very sexy, .. done a good job improving those ....

Ive been checking her form and to my own personal opinion the problem lies with the hips, ... hope you dont mind but I used your render to show what i mean rather than try to explain, .. its just easier visually, ... I trimmed off what I think is causing the problem (only my view on it)

This is just a suggestion Coolhand, .. see what you think ,...

*EDIT* After being pummelled by Brickhead for my hasty trimming, ... here's a more careful trim, .. I think its just the bulges that need pulling in a tad to match the rest of the form hugging suit. I'll leave it at that, ... Im off down the shop to get some Anti-Brickhead Spray, .. just incase :shiner:

*Edit* Now Steve's seen it, Image removed

Jas

specs2

4th Jun 2007, 15:47

mmh, i don't see a difference between the two, even though you mentioned it...

Brickhead

4th Jun 2007, 15:48

Oh man!! Binkerman I'm going to disagree with you 100%. The proportions of the original are correct. A womans hips start at the waste not at the thigh. The proportions you show are correct if she was a pygmy, my apologies to any pygmy"s that might have been offended. Also she is wearing a flight suit that is padded, which looks awesome BTW coolhand, not a latex bodysuit. So that will also change some of the proportions. She came out beautiful Steve, love the lips.

specs2

4th Jun 2007, 15:52

oh, now I C, why I didn't see a difference... I was looking at her "lips" not her "hips". :stupid:

Binkerman

4th Jun 2007, 15:59

@ Brickhead:

heh, thats OK mate, .. guess I like Pygmies in Latex, ... damn My fetish is revealed .... seriously though, to me its around that area that may need adjusting a tad, ... as I say its only my view on it, ... Take it with a pinch of salt Coolhand, you're doing a great job regardless :thumb: ...

Jas

Coolhand

5th Jun 2007, 04:18

It's nice to see some more discussion going on in here... thanks for your comments guys.

specs, err, in what way? i'm not finished with it but i've been pretty happy with the suit so far.

Binkerman, i appreciate it mate but, hmm, i'm not sold. the hips look a bit too low, and to me it's as if she's being constricted too much, she is meant to be a bit more athletic than curvy (though with some curves too of course;)) good luck with that pygmy bondage thing too...:shiner:

Bricks, thanks mate, i'm not sure about the upper lip though, the midpart perhaps doesn't have the right curvature.

L2K

5th Jun 2007, 18:08

I think that even scifi flight suits have to be larger.
you have to put a lot a thingies in those suits.
anti-G suit-trousers, big thermal fibers, climatization tube network, maybe one or two pockets,.....

I believe it has to be bigger, even if your not planig to make it space proof.

specs2

5th Jun 2007, 18:22

I'd say, make the padding more like the right example on my image. the left one resembles more your style.
The round style is good, but not perfect yet.

jay-mo

5th Jun 2007, 20:00

First off, that flight suit is killer. Great job on this overall. My only crit is the proportions of the body look a little off. Maybe It's because my view of human anatomy have been skewed by comic books and scifi, but I like the longer limb look. I hope you don't mind, but I took the liberty of PSing your pic, so I could show you my suggestions, it's really hacked up, but you should be aable to get the idea.:)

Jay, that looks awesome, hey it's brickhead, right?;) Great work on the face, do you wanna post any wires?

Sorry for late response to this. The model is sitting somewhere in a pile of backup cd's, I could look for it if you still want to see the wires.:)